Imagine having the power to gain a full diagnostic of your current health right in the comfort of your own home? Vessel has given us the capability to do so. Christian Chasmer, Partner and COO of Vessel demistfys this new technology by walking us through their at home wellness testing kit. The personalized analysis that is affordable to all, will provide you with the ability to get a breakdown of any deficiencies, give unique recommendations specific to you and connect you with actual wellness professionals all from the palm of your hand! Growing up in a small town in Southern New Jersey, Christian was raised to live life with “no what-ifs.” Using this mentality to guide him in his career, he started multiple businesses, consulted with 7 and 8 figure companies on systems, leadership, and scaling before becoming a partner and COO at health tech company Vessel. The secret to his success lies in the systems he uses for both his personal life and his business. BIO: Growing up in a small town in Southern New Jersey, Christian was raised to live life with “no what-ifs.” Using this mentality to guide him in his career, he started multiple businesses, consulted with 7 and 8 figure companies on systems, leadership, and scaling before becoming a partner and COO at health tech company Vessel. He’s also the author of the #1 Best-Selling book Lose the Limits: Break Your Limiting Beliefs, Become a More Productive You, Achieve Everything You Want in Life. Now, Christian lives in San Diego where he builds impact-driven technology companies as an entrepreneur. The secret to his success lies in the systems he uses for both his personal life and his business.
🧪 Future of Health Technology
🧪 Wellness Testing Kits You Can Use At Home
🧪 FINALLY an At Home Health Solution THAT WORKS
🧪 Innovations Within the Health and Wellness Space
🧪 Affordable, Easy Health and Wellness Testing to Predict Diseases
🧪 Skip the Expensive Sleep Diagnostics - This is Only A $10 Test
🧪 It Might Not Be Insomnia, You Might Have a Deficiency
🧪 Empowering Yourself to Take Charge of Your Body and Sleep
🧪 This Deficiency Could Be Keeping You Up At Night
🧪 Supplements vs Holistic Approach - How Vessel Gives You BOTH Recommendations
🧪 Demystifying New Technology By Reinventing Old Scientific Methods
🧪 Custom Made Lifestyle, Nutrition, and Behavior Plans to Improve Your Body and Your Sleep
QUOTES:
“I woke up and I was like, Oh, this is what high quality sleep feels like. This is totally different than just falling asleep easily. This is like actually sleeping really well.”
“What are the little levers I can pull to have a huge impact in my life and those little levers right there completely transformed my sleep quality.”
“Being able to give that power to people and then kind of shine the mirror and show them that, Hey, this is what's going on inside your body and you can change it.”
Mollie McGlocklin - The Sleep Is A Skill Podcast - Ep 034 (1...
Wed, 2/10 11:52AM • 43:48
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
test, sleep, people, magnesium, cortisol, health, felt, home, supplements, app, life, big, create, recommendations, therapist, vessel, parse, understand, sharing, fascinating
00:00
This skill podcast. My name is Mollie McGlocklin. And I own a company that optimizes sleep through technology accountability and behavioral change. Each week, I'll be interviewing world class experts ranging from doctors, innovators, and thought leaders to give actionable tips and strategies that you can implement to become a more skillful sleeper. Let's jump into your dose of practical sleep training.
00:29
Welcome to the sleep as a skill podcast. My guest today is Christian chasma. And he is a partner and COO at the health tech company vessel. And we were speaking about that because their products can actually give you readouts of your magnesium levels, your vitamin D levels, your vitamin C levels, your pH, your hydration, your cortisol, which is in their beta at the moment. And then we'll get into in this conversation that what sounds like it's on the way out should be rolled out is calcium and iron, which would all be very exciting. And another reason you know, there's this is not the only game in town as far as health tests at home health tests, of course. But what makes them really unique is that this one is urine base. So you basically pee on it like a pregnancy test. And instead of getting you know, the results, are you pregnant, are
01:20
you not? This one will give you all those results that I mentioned about some of those health markers. And it's particularly relevant in this conversation around sleep. And not only are they doing that, in general, but they're also aiming to do this at an affordable price. That's one of the things we got into with Christian is that as of right now, at the time of this recording in 2021, that the average price of each stick with different memberships that you can get can be as low as around 10 bucks per stick, which makes me really excited and feels like it's on the forefront of what I envision in the future for the ability for the masses for all of us to really have more and more access to some of this data for understanding our health. And then but then making sense of the data, which they really do a great job of helping to make happen. One of the things I love about this product and app is that the user interface and user experience is very streamlined, and then gives you actionable things to do with that information. Because I have been testing a number of at home testing kits because of course with COVID they are huge and booming. You know if we want to get information about ourselves, but we maybe don't have the ability to access some of our healthcare providers in person in the same way that we might have before these at home tests can be really invaluable. But some of them it's you know, costs an arm and a leg and so if we can even just get some insights into our health and take those baby steps. I think that that can be really empowering for people and this can be one of them. So a little bit about our guest let's see so his bio states growing up in a small town in southern New Jersey Christian was raised to live life with no what ifs, a point that was driven home by the death of many people close to him, including his father at the age of 11, and his godfather at the age of 18. After surviving a near death experience in one which one of his close friends died, Christian knew that he needed to empower others to live with know what if and pursue what makes them fulfilled in life. While in college, he built a franchise from $0 to 1.2 million in annual revenue. He then co founded the real estate development company cc solutions and grew it to 6.5 million in revenue and under two years. From there, he started elevate advisors, which consulted with seven to eight figure companies on systems leadership and scaling before becoming a partner and CEO at the health tech company vessel. He's also the author of the number one best selling book lose the limits break your limiting beliefs become a more productive you achieve everything you want in life. He now lives in San Diego where he builds impact driven technology companies as an entrepreneur. The secret to his success lies in the systems he uses for both his personal life and his business. So let's jump into today's episode. Now before we get into the podcast, I do want to take a quick minute to give a shout out to our sponsor better help or as I like to call it a therapist in your pocket. It's the exact app that I use when I was going through my really challenging period of insomnia while traveling overseas. And the ability to maintain a consistent therapist in real life was just really not an option for me since we were jumping around from country to country. So the ability to With using my phone have video calls weekly with my therapist that was paired with a for me Actually, I connected with a great therapist right off the bat. But I do know other people who have been able to kind of shop around with some of the therapists on that app until they find a great fit for them. And in between those calls, one of the things that I found was really helpful is that you can also send voice notes, text messages, images in between that you no longer weekly video call, so that you do have this really very real ongoing connection and support that I certainly, at least in my experience hadn't felt with real life therapists that I've used in the past. And also the pricing structure is much more competitive than a lot of the real life therapists that you can come into contact with. So I found it to be a lot of benefits. I recommend it to a lot of people that are just kind of going through struggles in their life, or just simply want to be able to uplevel and get bringing that level of reflection and awareness into their life, about what's both working and not worth getting. And you can certainly cancel it anytime and for our sleepy community. The better help company has hooked us up with 10% off if you go to better help calm forward slash sleep is a skill
06:13
again, better help calm forward slash sleep is a skill. And welcome to the sleep as a skill Podcast. I am so excited Christian to get into this conversation, we already had an opportunity to kind of, you know, discuss just some of the things that we're looking to parse out on this conversation. But I'm one just welcome. Thank you so much for taking the time to speak on something called sleep as a skill to how we can understand how your product with vessel can help make a difference in our sleep. So thank you. Thank you.
06:44
Yeah, thanks for having me, Molly. I'm excited.
06:46
Awesome. I'm excited too. I got an opportunity to share with you that you know, so you guys were great had sent over the box, the vessel to go through and test out. And of course, we'll get into what that is and how that pertains to sleep. But I I was sharing that for some reason the box, it looks so beautiful. And you're just the presentation. And somehow I got this is how I do life. I like overthought it and was like okay, this is gonna take a while I need to set aside some time. I did it this morning, it took two seconds, it was so easy. Oh my goodness, how you do anything is how you do everything. But it was really, really fascinating. So I can't wait to learn more about and how people can utilize this to help with their certainly all over health. But then in you know this conversation sleep. So I would like to give you the floor to kind of share one just how you got into this world of kind of at home testing, and then how that can make a difference with this conversation of sleep and the skill set of sleep.
07:47
Yeah, absolutely. The genesis of vessel is pretty fascinating. JOHN, my co founder, he is a serial entrepreneur like myself, and he has been a serial entrepreneur for 20 plus years. And then in his mid 30s, he started getting really bad brain fog. And he started to get fatigued in the middle of the day, getting tired, etc. He went to a bunch of doctors, and they were just telling them, hey, it's part of being older, you're getting older, this is just happening. And he was like, No, that's that's not true. There's something going on here. And after going to five doctors over the course of the year still having the brain fog, he finally went to a nutritionist, and they took a blood test. And she found that they he had a b 12 deficiency. And she's like, just start taking more b 12. Your brain fog should go away, he started taking v 12. Brain fog went away in a couple of weeks. So something that was affecting him for two years and took him five doctors 1000s of dollars blood testing, a simple b 12 deficiency, which you can get anywhere. And that kind of was the genesis of thinking about Okay, wow, why did that happen? What's going on here and then looking at the future of health technology, the idea started coming of Hey, we can bring this into the home we can make it more accessible, more affordable. And about a year to two years into that the prototyping and the project thing phase me and john met. I'm super into health and fitness. I was a wrestler in high school in college. Like I mentioned, I've been a serial entrepreneur as well, we met at an event he was telling me about this company, the prototype and what they were thinking about doing. I was so bought in I was I'm in love with health technology in the future of really being able to allow people to understand what's going on inside their body, and then give them the recommendations to improve that. So it's really about like waking up to this idea that you can actually change what's going on inside your body. Most people if they're sleeping poorly. They just think that's who they are. They don't feel empowered to do anything about it. But really like I love your podcast name because it's so accurate. It's a skill. It's something we can improve on, just like many other areas of our life. So being able to give that power to people and then kind of shining the mirror and show them that hey, this is what's going on inside your body and you can change it. And she speaks to me so deeply. So I came in as a consultant at first and then after a few months of working together, me and john realized that we can really do Build a really great thing together. So then I bought in as a co founder and CEO, Oh,
10:03
wow. Okay, so the the passion is for sure there. And then those personal stories of then being able to, you know, with something to your point where it's a piece of information that, you know, relatively, quote unquote easy to access, but it's the action of doing that the ease of doing that having the lens by which to make adjustments accordingly after that learning these this information, and then how transformative that can be. So that's amazing. I love hearing that. So from that place, yeah, if you can walk us through the iterations then of so you have this concept, and then you guys start kind of development process of that, and how are kind of getting that out to market? And what have you begun to see, like, first of all, just like the ABCs of how does this app work? Because I've explained it to a couple different people. It's like, why is pregnancy test? So yeah, if you can kind of just start at the beginning on that, that would be super helpful.
11:01
Yeah. So at the highest level, what vessel is, is, it's a wellness test card that people pee on in their home. And then they take a photo of the card with their smartphone. And our algorithm and our machine learning algorithm will read that card and be able to tell them what their levels are up to 15 different health markers. So right now, it's B, seven, B nine, cortisol, magnesium, vitamin C, hydration, pH, the ketones, and soon we'll be coming out with calcium and iron as well. So yeah, and then you can see right there, what you're deficient in, in under three minutes. And then we have recommendation engine that tells you what to what to eat. In order to get into the optimal range of everything you're deficient in, you can order that food right from the app, or we also have a custom supplement that's based on your results. So it's got everything you need, nothing you don't need. And then we also have nutritionist on chat as well. So really, for us, it was all about giving people access, allowing them to understand that data, and then being able to optimize their health and fitness. So it's a full solution to something that we felt was very fractured in the marketplace.
12:04
Absolutely. Yeah. in alignment with what I was sharing earlier, I had the experience of finally testing that out this morning. And I just thought it was so cool. I'm really into the kind of just the ease and the innovation and the the design I'm very, you know, the style of it was just the whole experience was Easy, easy. And I just love for the walking you through how to do it, it takes out you know, the kind of drawings and visuals to show. So again, sharing of my overthinking tendency, and a lot of certainly some of my clients that will overthink it is am I doing it? Right? I don't know, it really kind of walks you through that. So that was not a concern at all. So God Okay, so now you're getting into these homes, it's being sent at home, certainly during a time when so many, that's is a concern. I have a lot of clients that Yeah, I would like to do some testing. But no, I'm not going to go and go into certain kind of weather hospitals, lab tests, I'm not going to you know, be in that conversation. Certainly some of my clients that are in the older kind of clientele, their concerns, and they've immune system issues, so it can be sent at home. And then I'd love to get into then what your results look like and how those can what that can lend for this conversation around sleep. So people aren't sleeping, they know something's up, what are some of the common things that might appear on the results that would reflect the sleep issues?
13:30
Yeah, specifically asleep. What we see and it's it's a common thing in America is one either high cortisol, which is your high in stress, and that can cause poor sleep quality. But two, and it's very common is low magnesium. A lot of people have a magnesium deficient that they don't even know about. And magnesium can create one emotional instability and two very poor sleep. One example of this, which is really interesting, a close friend of mine, she was part of our early early beta study before we had like anything. We took her test levels over the course of about two weeks, and noticed that she was very low in magnesium. And she was reporting that she was having really poor sleep. She's been having poor sleep for a long time. And we noticed that she was low magnesium. So then we gave supplements, and didn't tell her what the supplements were. But we just told her, Hey, take these supplements for two weeks. We had magnesium in the supplements. She started taking the magnesium. We started continued the testing, her magnesium levels started to go up. And after a couple of weeks, she was telling me in an offhand way, she's like, man, I am sleeping so much better. I feel so much like calmer and like more stable, like, I'm just feeling really good lately. And I don't know why. And in my head, I'm like, well, because we're getting magnesium supplements and you're seeing your magnesium levels go up. That was a really big lightbulb and an eye opening moment for me of like, oh, wow, this can really help in these small levers that most people don't understand what's going on inside the body can have a huge impact. Same thing with one of our earliest investors. He took the test, he was very skeptical of the product, he took the test started having he noticed he had low magnesium, started taking magnesium supplements, started sleeping better and invested a quarter of a million dollars in the company, because he was like, this was so easy. And so impactful. Because obviously, if you're sleeping, it's improved, every other aspect of your life gets improved. So that's obviously one piece of the test. And it's specifically related to sleep, we noticed that a lot of people are low in magnesium don't know about it. And that affects their sleep quality.
15:31
Really cool. And so from that place with the magnesium concern are there. So the recommendation so I, again, I just did this this morning, so I got to dive in deeper to some of the recommendations. So presumably, then you can order their suggested types of magnesium on the app? Is it? Do you kind of parse out different elements at different times of the day? Or does it? Is it kind of in individual for the person?
15:54
Yeah, that's a great question. So there are better like, not all supplements are created equal, everyone now is starting to understand that that there's a lot of BS supplements out there. And that's really important. And what our recommendation engine will show is like what foods you can eat to get into the optimal range. So what foods can give you magnesium. And then if you want a magnesium supplement will tell you how much magnesium and what kind of magnesium to take, you can take that and go buy a supplement anywhere you want. Or you can take the vessel fuel, which has the magnesium in it plus whatever else you were deficient in, custom made to your specifics in terms of how much magnesium and then how much of the other supplements, you can order that right from the app too. So really, it's agnostic in terms of where you get it. Ideally, you'd be getting it from food first, because food first is just an important principle. That's hard, though, for things like magnesium and other items, it's very hard to get the proper amount. So then you have the supplement where you can buy it anywhere, or you can get the vessel fuel right from the app as well.
16:53
Very cool. Okay. So from that place, people are making some of those adjustments. But then going back to kind of like the naysayers or the, you know, the guy who then got on board and then even invested a ton of money based on his results for those people that have concerns about the legitimacy of this and how would the phone know it's taking a picture? Like, could you kind of walk us through the specifics of that, like the the functionality of that, is that kind of tested? Are there kind of trials, the efficacy?
17:24
Totally? Yeah, well, what's fascinating about this is that's the first objection that everyone's gonna have, right, and rightfully so we should have a healthy amount of skepticism for things that are coming out 100% of the time. What's interesting about vessel is we're not necessarily creating any new forms of testing. So the two tests that are on the card have been around for about 50 years lateral flow assays is one type of test, just like a pregnancy test right up on it, and you see a line. So we created lateral flow assays using 56 year old technology that can measure four different things in a quantifiable way. So we're using the same technology, we're just building on old technology. And same thing with the colorimetric pads. So we have the lateral flow assays and color metric pads, the color metric pads are a dipstick for a pool, have you ever tested the pH of a pool, you dipped it in it changes color, right, that's just like that. It's exactly the same technology, we've just created different chemistries that allow to read for different things like magnesium and vitamin C, etc. So these are common, you can get some off the shelf for different types of chemistries, the ones that we've created from scratch, are because we noticed that the ones that were off the shelf from major companies were actually less accurate, then what we wanted, and what will to our specifications. So we formulated ones that were more accurate and more repeatable. But the technology itself is very old. So that's what's fascinating about it. And then in terms of the algorithm, it's a computer vision algorithm that reads the color change of the pads, and then it can read the lateral flow assays, and then give a results. And we actually have a third party validation study to prove this accuracy. There's many medical devices like this out there that have already been FDA approved, as well. So we actually follow the guidelines of the FDA and what the benchmark criteria was for accuracy, when we are looking to develop our product as well. So it's extremely innovative in how we're using it. But the baseline foundational technology has been around for 50 years now.
19:22
Really interesting. Okay. And I know we spoke to, of course, to magnesium for the sleep topic, but then on your I just happened to be on your website at the moment. And the design is really, really cool. I definitely encourage people to check that out. Again, like I said, I'm very into the design and the ease, it kind of helps to take the guesswork out of things. But um, I like how you do this kind of visual of parsing out some of these different things and how they can affect these different topics. And you so I'm looking at this now as as you've walked us through the legitimacy of these testing and that this isn't Some like brand new tech, it's it's a new way of doing it. But it's something that's been established and kind of count Audible for some time. And now you guys have just kind of taken it to the next level. So from that place, then there's different types of things that we can read for. And so certainly impacting overall health and well being and then the conversation of sleep. So based on what I'm seeing on here, too, so vitamin B, seven hydration, cortisol and ketones, pH, vitamin B, nine are fully vitamin C, magnesium and ketones and so ketone a ketone B. So out of these, many of them as they show this nifty little infographic, that many of them certainly pointing to sleep. So I know we've certainly touched on magnesium, cuz that's a big heavy hitter. But I'm wondering if you could also share other people have any like, you know, success stories with some of the other ones or, I mean, even just the hydration one and how that can influence sleep and, you know, certain kind of examples of people being able to shift their either behavior and diet or supplements to support overall health, but also that sleep.
21:08
Yeah, sure. Another heavy hitter is cortisol too. So that's the stress hormone cortisol, people who are typically high in cortisol have trouble sleeping. So what Ares does is when you when you read high cortisol, we actually give lifestyle recommendations to lower that cortisol, whether that's yoga, meditation, walking, items like that, that are actually scientifically research backed to lower cortisol, there's a that goes back then gets added to your plan, that you can choose which one you want to do. And then you follow that, and then you can see the cortisol levels go down. So all of our recommendations are backed by peer to peer research studies, which you'll see in the app, all of them are linked to studies right there. So cortisol is a big one. I would say in order, it's like magnesium, cortisol in terms of sleep, and then you obviously have hydration too, for if you're dehydrated, that leads to trouble sleeping, rare, but if you're over hydrated, that also leads to trouble sleeping, because you're peeing a lot during the night as well. So it's, it's rare for people to be over hydrated and under or to be dehydrated, but it is something we notice a lot too when people are over hydrated. And then they're like, oh, maybe I should stop drinking water after 8pm before bed. So those are probably the big three. Beneath that you have B nine, which is for energy as well and sleep quality all in and then vitamin C underneath that for immune system energy could affect sleep. There's actually some science behind low vitamin C affecting sleep. But I would say the big three are the magnesium, the cortisol in the hydration.
22:37
Awesome. Yeah, no, I think you're spot on with that. Have you seen any issues for people with low cortisol, kind of like the flip side where that being a bit of a problem of how to manage that?
22:49
That's interesting. We haven't specifically seen a lot of low cortisol, it's usually good cortisol or high cortisol, low cortisol is typically a sign of a different type of health issue that we've noticed. So it's usually you're in the good range or in the high range for cortisol. But we haven't specifically looked at too many low cortisol cases, and then link them to like sleep. Particularly.
23:11
Got that Yeah, yeah, that's an interesting one. She was you'll see different clients that will invest in say, like the Dutch test and looking at their cortisol at different points throughout the day. And then some of them kind of flatlining at certain points where we wouldn't want that to be the case. And yeah, so it can get certainly more nuanced. But I hear you, I think you're agree with those that kind of top down, look at some of the ones that are some of the biggest, most fruitful ones to look at your purchase leap and the excitement around things like iron being able to be tested for in the future. What is the timeline? Or do we know the timeline for something like that? Or ballpark?
23:47
Yeah, iron, the goal is to come out with that in q2, so we'll come out with calcium before iron and then iron would be like a q2.
23:54
Wow, exciting. Okay. So having said all that, what do you see as some of the the future for your product, some of the implications for things of this nature? It seems as if you're quite the visionary, what are some of your hopes or what you could see coming down the pike for something like this, the the applications of it?
24:15
Yeah, there's a lot of areas that we're really interested in going into. One is different different markets in terms of the specific user, so a women's health card, a pediatrics card, an athlete's card, and really being able to add tests that add specific value for women's health, pediatrics and athletes. So that's one major focus for us as we continue to add chemistries, looking at how can we group different tests together to add the most value for that person. So that's one big one different modalities is another one that we're going to be going into over the next year to which it means like blood testing for different things like vitamin D, and items like that saliva testing in home, we actually have already built the software behind a blood test at home. So we will be working On that in the future as well to where you can test your vitamin D, cholesterol, different things like that using a blood test at home. Another one that we already have a patent on, which will be coming out in the next year to two years is an on toilet version. So you can actually attach it to your toilet, you can pee like normal, it'll automatically collect your sample, run it, run it through a test of about 40 different chemistries, and then send all the results to your phone automatically. So it's a completely automated version, which I think is going to be really powerful, it also would then reduce the cost per test significantly. So it's, it's really exciting for us, we're really excited to bring that like hardware piece out there, because I think it'll add, it'll reduce the friction for people to test. And it'll allow more people to test more frequently get better data, and then obviously change their behavior and make better decisions and impact their lives in a bigger way. So those are some of the exciting ones, the longer term future vision that we have is really around different disease diagnostic cards as well. So there's a lot of research coming out for being able to detect certain kinds of cancers in urinalysis testing. And so being able to bring that type of disease diagnostics to the home as well in an affordable, accessible way, where I see a future where, let's call it 10 years from now, people in home health tracking is as routine as brushing your teeth where people so affordable, so accessible, so easy. It's like Yeah, why wouldn't you brush your teeth, like, of course, you're going to brush your teeth, you got it, you got to stay healthy. And that's where I see it going, where people are doing their health and wellness tests, whether that's once a week or once a month, understanding the minerals and the nutrition that's going on inside their body. And then maybe once a month or once a quarter, they're taking their disease diagnostics test, where they're understanding if they're having kidney cancer, or certainly things like that, where we can catch it in the home, extremely affordable, before it gets too late. My dad passed away from when I was 11 years old, from a cancer that was completely treatable. But we were from a lower middle class family who never goes to the doctor because you can't afford it. It's too expensive. You can't take the time off work. So being able for me to be to bring this type of understanding and access to people's health data to the home is really the most important thing, the most exciting thing I could be working on right now. And that's really where the vision we see is getting into the hands getting a lab in every hand Really?
27:20
Oh, well. First of all, I'm so inspired by all of that, that sounds incredible. It actually reminds me of I feel like I heard Ray Kurzweil, the futurist, talking about this, like years back of, you know, one day, you'll have smart toilets, and you know, there'll be little bots in your blood and blah, blah, I call it sounded so like, okay, sure, like way down the road. But then here we are talking about, you know, some of these add on elements that could make it really a regular part of life. So I love that very exciting. And I also appreciate your vulnerability and sharing some of the kind of one I'm so sorry about your dad and two as someone that also grew up in, you know, family who was on welfare when I was younger, like, you know, not coming from a lot of extra. Certainly, yeah, the extra was not there, and certainly was not going to health optimization in any way, shape, or form. So what you're doing is very, particularly hits home for me, and I'm sure for many others listening. And actually, that was going to be one of my next questions was for people when thinking of investing in something like this, I think that can be a one of obviously the considerations is what are the finances? Or what are the financials with that. So I wonder if you could help parse out like what people could expect to spend with something like this product where it's at now i'm sure things will iterate and change in the future. But is there like a baseline package? Or should there be an expectation of testing again? And again? What is the thinking there?
28:53
Yeah, absolutely. There's two main options right now to test and that's once a month or once a week. So it's a membership option. And it comes out to about $10 a test. So it's it's quite affordable already. And we're working to bring those costs down as well. As we continue to scale up, we'll get economies of scale, and we'll continue to build a design that can cut costs and reduce the cost and keep the value for the customer. So right now it's monthly testing or just once a week testing and the average test amount is $10. A test right now.
29:26
Awesome. Okay, so that is incredible. This certainly when I'm in this conversation with for people with sleep, there can be so many unknowns, and it's like, Where do I invest my money than sleep? You know, totally general is like this booming, you know, imagine to be multibillion dollar in the next couple years, even even right now. It's incredible. So there's a little question or a big question of where do I put my money? what's worth it? I've had other people come back and say, I'm not going to do the testing because even if it says high cost cortisol, then, you know, what am I supposed to do with that? So I'm just gonna start with, you know, some of the basics. Certainly what I'm hearing is that when you do hone in on some of these things, this particulars can really make a difference, the knowledge of that and where you stand, and then to kind of cutting out some of those really large financial concerns that you guys are really getting a bundle of that from the sounds of it.
30:24
Yeah, absolutely. And, and the membership also includes obviously, the access to the app to which has all your recommendations, so the whole recommendation engine, and then you can build a plan, you can follow your plan, you get access to the nutritionist on chat as well. So it's a once again, it's a whole solution for that price point, not just the testing, I find that really frustrating too. When I go, I've taken all the blood tests, you can take the microbiome test, I've done it all. And a lot of the times I take the test, it's a couple 100 bucks, if not 1000 bucks, and then you're like, Okay, what do I do with this? How do I actually follow through with this? Like, what do I do? How do I do it? And and then I'm lost. And then it just becomes a document on my, my health folder on my laptop that I look at? And I'm like, Oh, yeah, like, I now know that and I have nothing to it, there's no actionability out of it. So with our membership, you know, the the goal really, is to create this actionable plan for people to one get the results to create the plan, and then three follow through on the plan. So it's a whole solution that we're trying to build with the membership.
31:25
Wow, really interesting. Okay, so with the the app kind of holding your results, and then the recommendations being there, what are some of the expectations? I know, it depends on the different areas, it might be, you know, shorter or faster, but say people see, okay, I'm high cortisol, and I start putting in, you know, some of these recommendations, is it just totally across the board for how long it will take for people to start to see, you know, improvements? And are there certain different ones that you've seen a speedier transition, so Oh, low magnesium, start taking the magnesium. It's faster? Which ones kind of, are there a timeline that's developing? Or is it still up in the air?
32:06
Yeah. So what's fascinating is we're starting to pick up all of that data right now, right, and we're starting to look at be able to look at that data and then make better recommendations in the future. So it's getting smarter and smarter and smarter. What we've noticed so far is it's about two weeks, and this is doctors of backtest. And this is what we what we just learned in the space too, is it takes about two weeks for supplements and food to kick in and start really creating that baseline where you're starting to feel the effects of what you're doing. So we always we set that expectation of like, hey, this, just because you take a magnesium pill today doesn't mean you're going to feel better tomorrow, it takes a bit for your body to get used to it takes a bit for your the food that you're changing to get actually absorbed by your body and then get put through the changes. So it takes usually about two weeks for people to start feeling the effects if you're making these changes. And that's, that's the expectation we set as well.
32:57
Got it. Okay. And then people can if they have those particular questions they can reach out to like, within the chat, there's the kind of nutritionist on hand and coaching on hand. And so those real life people, are they automated? What does that look like?
33:11
No, yeah, they're real life people. Yes, certified nutritionists and registered dietitians
33:16
real life, their real life. People, this is a very rare nowadays.
33:21
People did the real one slots
33:22
everywhere, you know, so Okay, got it. All right, good. Really cool. All right. So I'm sure there's out of this, you know, a lot of things can come up to where there's the psychological elements going into there with the cortisol is that some of the process to kind of mindset and that sort of thing? Or is that get a little more esoteric and hard to measure? And with magnesium and stressors?
33:45
Yeah, yeah, it's a great question with the with the cortisol. And then when you get into the psychology of it, because it is a stress hormone, right. So we create that's times, that's where we recommend those lifestyle changes of like meditation, yoga, walking, different things like that. And then the idea is you can put that in your plan, you can follow through on the plan. And then you can see how your cortisol levels are and also how you feel after doing that maybe, maybe for you walking doesn't actually lower your cortisol and and start lowering your stress. So maybe after a week or two, you change it out, you try something else. So with the cortisol specifically, it really comes down to a lot of like the lifestyle changes that we that we recommend, and they're
34:26
really cool. Well, you'll have to keep us closely posted as you're starting to roll out all these other advancements, the blood, the saliva and other processes around that because the more and more can make that an easy, seamless thing because I've seen certain companies have certainly, I mean, this is such a huge market right now, especially with the pandemic and so many of us being at home, but you know, the more and more groups that can do it with just the ease factor being present is a big deal. Got that Okay, so so I'm sure out of this, a lot of people are interested then with your knowledge of all that you've been seeing around health optimization, when it's just asked you a few couple of questions for some of your habits as it relates to sleep. So when we started to add this in recently now kind of getting up under some of the feedback was like, well, I want to know what they're doing. So they're asleep. So and so you know, just sharing real quick, a couple quick questions for you. What are your nighttime routines as it relates to your sleep, anything that you've now with all that you're learning that you've brought in, that's made a difference for your sleep?
35:36
Yeah, it's fascinating. So my whole life I've always thought I slept well, I could fall asleep right away. Like, I'm the person that falls asleep before the plane takes off and then wakes up after the plane lands and asked if we'd left yet, so I've always just like slept very easily. And it wasn't until my partner at the time was having sleep issues that I realized, actually, I was probably like, at like 60% of what I could be for sleep quality. So my partner was having sleep issues. So we started hacking, we we got blackout curtains, we got soundproofing in the room, we started using red light at night, so that way we're not you know, simulating the sunlight, a red light nightlight in the bathroom, just in case if you go to the bathroom, you're only using red light. And we started making all these different changes, stop drinking water after 8pm at night, and I was going along, obviously, just to be supportive and whatnot, I started realizing is when I'd wake up in the morning after doing all these things, most notably the blackout, the soundproofing, and the red light and then the not drinking water. I woke up so much more alert, so much more awake than I've ever had before I used to wake up tired, and I was like, Well obviously I'm waking up tired. I was just sleeping. So obviously this is how you feel when you wake up, but I woke up and I was like, Oh, this is what high quality sleep feels like this is totally different than just falling asleep easily. This is like actually sleeping really well. So I've stuck with that and I've implemented those simple things and it's been a total game changer for me. Even when I travel now like I'll wear a sleep mask just in case it's bright making sure that I'm saying in a really quiet place I'm not drinking water after 8pm and then my red light even you can buy an Amazon red light for 12 bucks like clicks in us out for your bathroom nightlight that's the I always look at like what are the little levers I can pull to have a huge impact in my life and those little levers right there completely transformed my sleep quality to where I'm I don't even drink I don't drink caffeine anymore. Those like really easy simple to use ones were amazing and then like I mentioned earlier I started taking magnesium supplement I started sleeping even better as well because I was low in magnesium as well. There's a bunch of different things that I've tested and have tried over the years but I would say out of like the easy levers to pull that had a huge impact it was those of course like we also put our phones outside the room at night and so there's no EMF near us different items like that but yeah blackout curtains being quiet red light and not drinking water I would say the easiest ones that anybody can go do tomorrow and drastically impact their sleep quality.
38:08
I love that actually I just got the notification on my phone that my replacement little Amazon style red plug in motion sensor to the watch of the bathroom that because my other one just died is here just got delivered. I know it's so like it's hysterical that you said that so yes a huge anyone listening that doesn't have one of those hop on very affordable big, big game changer there. So thank you for that reminder. And then one of the other questions is kind of what's on your proverbial nightstand so like whether it's an app or gadget or supplement or any of those things and also you mentioned what's probably not on there so not the phone's not the What have you so what would we see there?
38:53
Yeah, on my literal nightstand right now is the daily stoic Oh, holiday so I read a page out of that every single morning for the past five years. My journal which I journal every morning I've been doing that for years now it's just a free write every single morning my pen and then my my low night my face mask thing just in case it's it's bright in my room for whatever reason. So those are the three things that are on my nightstand
39:20
I love that as an aside Ryan Holiday he runs Have you ever tried to spar the UPS bar for habit change? No I haven't tried to recommend it I don't know if what Ryan's affiliation is with it but I know he's run different challenges on there. And so it's so it's a it's an app part kind of gamifies habit change and so you like you sign up and then you put in your credit card and then you go you join different challenges say like you want to make your bed or whatever, but you have to check in each day and with video proof that you whatever made the bed and you're also geotags so some of them might be like your Waking up by now whatever 6am and then if you check in at 6:01am, then Nope, you get flagged and then you get whatever it's like 20 bucks goes into the pot and then it's like a whole community thing. Ryan Holliday does a daily stoic one or stoic kind of trended wide, which is really cool. He puts in a lot of energy into it and lots of principles there. So as an aside for anyone listening that wants to get on that train ways to gamify that to make sure you're actually doing it. So that's awesome. So having said that, then the last one being and I think it sounds like you might have already touched on a little bit, but any of your biggest sleep like aha moments or biggest change to your sleep game, and it sounds like you again, might have parse those out. But anything else that stands out,
40:47
that was definitely my biggest aha was sleep. I've also done a sleep study where I did for two weeks, different sleep quantities. So I did like eight hours, and then I went seven and a half, then I went Seven, six and a half, 655 and a half, four, to see where I felt the best over those periods of time, for I totally crashed, I was extremely tired and got sick. But it was really powerful for me, because I noticed during that that testing that I did that I felt really, really good. between six and a half and seven and a half hours of sleep. I felt alert, I felt really awake. I felt good. When I started getting into like eight and a half nine, it was like oversleeping for me. I was groggy The next day, and then anything under six and a half, I noticed like my mental clarity was slipping. So that took a lot of time. And like I journaled on my effects. But it was really fascinating to like, have that. And then understand, okay, this is kind of where I'm optimal, like the six and a half to eight, six and a half to seven and a half is like I felt really good during the time. And now that's the amount of hours I aim for every single night for the past four to five years.
41:50
Wow, what was that run out of? Was it a particular grouper? That's very interesting.
41:55
I just did it myself.
41:56
Oh, you did it yourself. Oh, God, I did a experiment.
42:00
Because everyone was always telling me that like eight to nine hours of sleep was the optimal. And then I was reading about like Elon Musk only sleeping four hours a night and being very fine. Yeah, I was like, okay, there's all this data out there. But my body is my body. And I want to know, what works for me. So I just did the test over a few months.
42:19
Wow. So interesting. Okay, because it sounded almost like it's like a facilitated study or examination into that. So that's fantastic. I love the experimentation, philosophy. So cool. you've provided so much information. So I'm sure you've piqued people's interest with this very user friendly product and philosophy. So where can people go to learn more about you, the company? All the things?
42:46
Yeah, they can go to vessel health calm. You can learn everything about it. You can read our science page, you can order it right from there. So yeah, vessel health. COMM is the easiest way to understand what vessel is what we do understand the test that we take and then potentially buy it if you if you see fit as well.
43:02
Really Great. Well, thank you so much for taking the time to share this information with us and also the vision of what is you know, to come or different possibilities. It's very, very exciting.
43:13
Yeah, thank you for having me, Molly's. It's been a lot of fun.
43:15
Oh, awesome. You've been listening to the sleep is a skill podcast, the number one podcast for people who want to take their sleep skills to the next level. Every Monday I send out something that I call Molly's Monday obsessions containing everything that I'm obsessing over in the world of sleep, head on over to sleep as guild comm to sign up